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post #16 of 89 (permalink) Old Aug 15th, 2012, 07:03 AM
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Re: Rule Changes

One alternative argument in favor of such a dramatic change to the format is that one major flaw with college tennis is how unbelievably hard it is to pull off a dramatic upset. On a given day, any team can beat another on the soccer pitch or on the basketball court, and sometimes even on the football field. By comparision, it is almost impossible for the number 25 team in the country to beat a top 5 team whereas you might see number 60 beat a top 5 team in basketball, baseball, or soccer on a given day. It would be a lot more fun if the better team didn't win quite as much as the current format insures. 3rd set superbreakers would certainly create a lot more opportunities for some surprise team results like it has already done for individual results (and rankings).
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post #17 of 89 (permalink) Old Aug 15th, 2012, 07:42 AM
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Re: Rule Changes

I'm not sure if the format change will actually translate to more upsets..would UF or USC have defeated STAN if the rule had changed then? Maybe players who're late starters might suffer, or strong hitters but less mobile(or fit) players might benefit..fit grinders will be at and disadvantage..power tennis might prevail further(maybe that's the aim? for a more 'exciting' & 'presentable' tennis for TV?) but overall team results? We'll see? I imagine it'll be like the change of attacking time from 30 sec. to 24 sec. in Basketball..(that rule actually favored the stronger teams, methink)


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post #18 of 89 (permalink) Old Aug 15th, 2012, 08:06 AM
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Re: Rule Changes

is this change applicable for only Team competition or also to Individual?

Anyway, it surely will be less demanding to players

For example, we see this kind of a score quite often; 0-6 7-5 6-0

Now, it won't be THAT discouraging for the player who won the 1st and narrowly lost the 2nd; You don't have to f***ing win the whole 6 games again, just 10 pts or something Less mentally damaging!

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post #19 of 89 (permalink) Old Aug 15th, 2012, 08:34 AM
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Re: Rule Changes

Colette's take (bottom half of her post): http://tenniskalamazoo.blogspot.co.u...announced.html
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post #20 of 89 (permalink) Old Aug 15th, 2012, 03:33 PM
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Re: Rule Changes

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Originally Posted by fantic View Post
is this change applicable for only Team competition or also to Individual?

Anyway, it surely will be less demanding to players

For example, we see this kind of a score quite often; 0-6 7-5 6-0

Now, it won't be THAT discouraging for the player who won the 1st and narrowly lost the 2nd; You don't have to f***ing win the whole 6 games again, just 10 pts or something Less mentally damaging!
In this vein, I could even argue that there will be even LESS upsets(less choking); The one who wins the 1st is more likely to actually win the match. And tiebreak might benefit strong servers, and also who has strong mental game; both are generally GOOD, not bad players.

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post #21 of 89 (permalink) Old Aug 15th, 2012, 03:45 PM
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Re: Rule Changes

for Team dual, there might be more upsets say like between 10th and 15th ranked teams.
But say between like 5th and 20th ranked teams? I'm not sure, the stronger teams' players will win in 2 sets anyway, and will that change? The less the match, the more important will be offensive weapons; in tiebreak, who has a strong serve and drive we'll likely to benefit=better players. That's the reason I said adv. Stanford since they're aggressive flat hitters and the cream of the crop.

I guess it'll affect more individually. For example, a slow starter, and a grinder who excels at a long match, say like KK, won't benefit.

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post #22 of 89 (permalink) Old Aug 15th, 2012, 04:00 PM
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Re: Rule Changes

I do think that a shortened singles format will lead to more upsets just because of the upsets that we already see happen much more frequently when the third set superbreaker is played because the team match is decided already.

Reading the blog on Zootennis.com, the potential for this change makes a lot more sense to me than it did when I first heard about it because this would really be just for the NCAA tournament unless adopted by the coaches for everything else. Not that I agree with the change, but the NCAA has the power to do what it wants with the tournament whereas past changes that have affected the regular season have taken a couple years of conversation, surveys, and debate before happening.

You may immediately tell me that if the NCAA tournament makes the change that all of the regular season will follow, but that isn't necessarily true. In the NCAA, golf uses a hybrid stroke play followed by team match-ups (just like tennis except with 5 players) for the final 16 teams, I think. To the best of my knowledge, those head-to-head team match-ups are not even used in any of the conference championships. I could see conference championships utilizing the format to get teams used to it, to differentiate the event from the regular season, and to ease the schedule of play (a potential second reason for the NCAA to be considering these changes). But that doesn't mean that coaches or conferences would use the format in dual matches throughout the year.

Why would the NCAA want to change the championships? One is the obviously mentioned television issue. Two is the difficulties that this past year's tournament presented. Because of weather and the length of matches, there were matches starting after 9:00 pm at night. Personally, I think that is pretty cool, but when that match has the potential to go for 4 hours, there could be some concern about playing at 1:30 in the morning. Under the current format, the NCAA schedules the round of 16 for 9:00, 12:00, 3:00 and 6:00 with pretty much no chance of even getting close to those starting times. Even the men's semifinals started late this year because of the length of the women's semifinals. While I love the final 16 format with combined men and women, I could see a cut back to a final four or an elite eight in order to keep the combined event and make it more manageable. Or you could do something drastic like change the format.
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post #23 of 89 (permalink) Old Aug 15th, 2012, 04:01 PM
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Re: Rule Changes

But fantic you should also look at it from the stance that in a full third set, the "better" player has more time to feel their strokes and play their way into form. In a 10 point breaker, if you get off to a slow start then it's very tough to come back. Also a lesser player can tree or hit a few lucky shots and all of a sudden they're up 6-3 in a breaker to 10.

You're generally right about the better server having an advantage in a shorter format but in women's college tennis...not so much.

There is a reason good players everywhere hate the 10 point tiebreaker. MORE chance of being upset, not less.

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post #24 of 89 (permalink) Old Aug 15th, 2012, 04:36 PM
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Re: Rule Changes

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I do think that a shortened singles format will lead to more upsets just because of the upsets that we already see happen much more frequently when the third set superbreaker is played because the team match is decided already.

...

Why would the NCAA want to change the championships? One is the obviously mentioned television issue. Two is the difficulties that this past year's tournament presented. Because of weather and the length of matches, there were matches starting after 9:00 pm at night. Personally, I think that is pretty cool, but when that match has the potential to go for 4 hours, there could be some concern about playing at 1:30 in the morning. Under the current format, the NCAA schedules the round of 16 for 9:00, 12:00, 3:00 and 6:00 with pretty much no chance of even getting close to those starting times. Even the men's semifinals started late this year because of the length of the women's semifinals. While I love the final 16 format with combined men and women, I could see a cut back to a final four or an elite eight in order to keep the combined event and make it more manageable. Or you could do something drastic like change the format.
The 1 am matches do happen, think Northwestern and UNC that last two years. In one way those match are legend, in another, its true its a problem. Though debating if it should go to an elite 8 format sounds more true to tennis.

Also even if they cut the heart out of tennis and got the matches down to 2 hours, tv scheduling would still be tough because starting times. If there is a chance of lightening in Georgia, the matches can't start on time, etc.

Anyway the future long distant fan of tennis will be watching with online streaming with a good scoreboard, and video quality like the USTA pro challenger., not with dinosaur technology.
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post #25 of 89 (permalink) Old Aug 15th, 2012, 05:11 PM
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Re: Rule Changes

Quote:
Originally Posted by iPatty View Post
But fantic you should also look at it from the stance that in a full third set, the "better" player has more time to feel their strokes and play their way into form. In a 10 point breaker, if you get off to a slow start then it's very tough to come back. Also a lesser player can tree or hit a few lucky shots and all of a sudden they're up 6-3 in a breaker to 10.

You're generally right about the better server having an advantage in a shorter format but in women's college tennis...not so much.

There is a reason good players everywhere hate the 10 point tiebreaker. MORE chance of being upset, not less.
You do have a point, I'm just a contrarian, wanted to offer an unorthodox? view How about Mal and Krista losing in 3 then?

Some (type of) players whom I think will benefit;

Sam Crawford, Kendal Woodard ; both good servers with some limited mobility
Mal Burdette
Brooke Austin, Krista Hardebeck, Nicole Gibbs; They aren't known for their excellent serves but they also can ATTACK serves
Kristie Ahn; because of the previous injuries

so, ultimately, qui bono? Stanford

You know who'll really luv it? Serena Williams

P.S. UCLA dbls are late starters, the changed format might hurt them.


Last edited by fantic; Aug 15th, 2012 at 05:41 PM.
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post #26 of 89 (permalink) Old Aug 15th, 2012, 05:25 PM
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Re: Rule Changes

Burdette, Gibbs, Ahn Hardebeck all have pro possibilities, this could not be good for them. Also bad for the future of the teams that can recruit players bubble on going pro.
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post #27 of 89 (permalink) Old Aug 15th, 2012, 05:34 PM
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Re: Rule Changes

In writing via zoo

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0By9s...preview?pli=1#
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post #28 of 89 (permalink) Old Aug 15th, 2012, 05:40 PM
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Re: Rule Changes

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Burdette, Gibbs, Ahn Hardebeck all have pro possibilities, this could not be good for them. Also bad for the future of the teams that can recruit players bubble on going pro.
true that.

I'm not saying that Stanford was INSTRUMENTAL on the change Just thought to list the type of players that might benefit(win matches) on the rule change.

Of course, in the long run, if they're going pro, not so good of course.

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post #29 of 89 (permalink) Old Aug 15th, 2012, 06:14 PM
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Re: Rule Changes

Is this presented as a done deal, or as an invitation to discuss? What is the procedure going forward.? Is there a vote? Can this be overturned?

Edit.

COllette Lewis tweets, Vote not required. Uproar could lead to revisions.
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post #30 of 89 (permalink) Old Aug 15th, 2012, 06:18 PM
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Re: Rule Changes

#notrealtennis. (a) Remove the warm-up with the opponent before singles and double.
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